How to Save Money Now with ChatGPT Finances (6 Real Use Cases) | Ethan Bloch

频道: Peter Yang
视频: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbzlqxkJrCU
原文语言: en
统计: 共 208 轮 · Ethan 117 · Peter 76

[0:00]

Chat GBT can just pay for itself. I have one that will run monthly, [music] which is checking all my subscriptions. Have any changed in price recently. Are there any you think I don't need anymore based on what you know about me? And that will just run each month and ping me. Help me figure out the best way to optimize taxes based on my current situation. I'm considering of buying a house. Here's how much. Build interactive site to help me think through it. When I'm making certain big financial decisions now, there's nothing I will make a decision about before I talk it through with chat. And I want to show you also what that looks like. Hey everyone, my guest today is Ethan, the product lead for Chhat GBT Finance. Really excited to get Ethan to show us how to use the product to save money and hopefully, you know, grow a portfolio. So, welcome Ethan.

Ethan： ChatGPT 完全可以自己把订阅费挣回来。我有一个每月跑一次的任务，专门检查我所有的订阅：最近有没有哪个涨价了？根据你对我的了解，有没有哪些你觉得我已经用不上了？它每个月自动跑一次，然后提醒我。「根据我目前的情况，帮我找出最好的税务优化方案。」「我在考虑买房，价格是这么多。做一个交互式网页，帮我把这件事想清楚。」现在我做一些重大财务决定时，没有哪个决定不是先跟 ChatGPT 聊透了才拍板的。我也想给你们看看那是什么样子。

Peter： 大家好，今天的嘉宾是 Ethan，ChatGPT Finances 的产品负责人。很期待请 Ethan 给我们演示一下怎么用这个产品省钱，最好还能让投资组合涨一涨。欢迎你，Ethan。

[0:41] Ethan

What's up, Peter? Thanks for having me. Really happy to be here.

嘿，Peter！谢谢你请我来，很高兴来做客。

[0:44] Peter

Dude, you you spent most of your career uh on this financial problem, right? Like on solving like helping people with their personal finances and everything. So, maybe before we get to the product, can you talk about your background and what you think AI unlocks for personal finance?

兄弟，你职业生涯的大部分时间都扑在理财这个问题上，对吧？就是想办法帮大家打理个人财务这些事。所以在看产品之前，能不能先聊聊你的背景，以及你觉得 AI 给个人理财解锁了哪些新可能？

[0:57] Ethan

Yeah, for sure. For sure. So, you know, for whatever reason, I have been obsessed with finance for a really long time. Actually, my first love was a computer at like six. And then my second love was finance for whatever reason. By, you know, 10, you know, I had had a credit card in my mom's name. I was balancing a checkbook. I had a bank account. And when I turned 13, I started uh day trading my bar mitzvah money. My parents, for some reason, thought that was okay. It just sort of kept pulling me, you know, and so it's just been a common theme. Again, when I was 13, this is sort of to set the time, 1998, so it was sort of the bull market of the internet bubble. I felt like a hero. And then by 2001, I sort of had my entire net worth wiped out. And so by the age of 15, I'd experienced what many people, you know, wait till later or maybe never experience. And again, it's always just a passion that, you know, eventually led me to where I am now. But I think most relevant to what I work on today. Way back in 2012, I'd actually started a company called Digit that was an AI financial chatbot that helped consumers save money. It was text message based and you would talk to it. And I really thought the technology was good enough to build an AI for everyone to help manage their money. We ended up helping, you know, millions of Americans save billions of dollars of the digit product. It was a 10-year journey, but a lot of what we wanted to do just wasn't possible. the tech wasn't good enough.

当然，当然。不知道为什么，我痴迷金融已经很久很久了。其实我的初恋是电脑，大概六岁的时候；第二个爱上的就是金融，也说不清为什么。到十岁左右，我已经有了一张挂在我妈名下的信用卡，会自己核对支票簿，还有了银行账户。13 岁那年，我开始拿成人礼（bar mitzvah）收到的礼金做日内交易。我爸妈不知怎么的，居然觉得这没问题。金融就是一直吸引着我，所以它算是贯穿我人生的一条主线。交代一下时间背景：我 13 岁那年是 1998 年，正赶上互联网泡沫的大牛市，我觉得自己简直是个英雄。结果到了 2001 年，我的全部身家差不多被清零了。所以 15 岁时，我就已经经历了很多人要到更晚才会经历、甚至一辈子都不会经历的事。总之，这份热爱一直都在，最终也把我带到了今天的位置。不过跟我现在做的事最相关的是：早在 2012 年，我创办了一家叫 Digit 的公司，做的是一个帮消费者存钱的 AI 理财聊天机器人。它基于短信，你直接跟它聊就行。我当时真心觉得技术已经足够好，可以给每个人打造一个帮忙管钱的 AI 了。最后我们通过 Digit 这个产品，帮几百万美国人存下了几十亿美元。那是一段十年的旅程，但我们想做的很多事根本实现不了——技术还不够好。

[2:24] Ethan

People would talk to Digit and it would tell him, you know, I'm sorry, I'm afraid I can't do that. And so I thought that was that and Dig ended up getting acquired in 2021 and I thought that dream sort of died more or less. But as we all know in 2022, Chad GBT came out and for me it was another sort of aha of maybe what we wanted to do at Digit would now be possible. I really didn't want to start another company. I just done a 10-year journey and I didn't really have to work and so I'm like what am I going to do with my life ended up starting another company focusing on what's now possible with LLMs and financial data with my co-founder RushBub we started that for you know really a year or so got an idea for a product started building that fast forward openai ended up acquiring us earlier this year in April of 2026 and so now I'm here within Cha GBT bringing forth all this, you know, passion and knowledge for building this AI for consumers that I've been thinking about for so long.

大家跟 Digit 对话，它常常只能回一句：「抱歉，恐怕我做不到。」所以我以为事情也就这样了。Digit 在 2021 年被收购，我以为那个梦想基本上就此破灭了。但大家都知道，2022 年 ChatGPT 问世，对我来说又是一个「啊哈」时刻：也许当年我们在 Digit 想做的事，现在终于能做成了。我其实真的不想再创业了。刚走完一段十年的旅程，我也不是非工作不可，所以就在想：我这辈子接下来要干什么？结果还是又创办了一家公司，专注于 LLM 结合金融数据现在能做到的事。我和我的联合创始人一起干了差不多一年，想出了一个产品点子，就开始动手做。快进到今年早些时候，2026 年 4 月，OpenAI 收购了我们。所以现在我在 ChatGPT 这边，把这么多年来一直在琢磨的、为普通消费者打造理财 AI 的热情和积累，全都带了过来。

[3:25] Peter

Got it. Okay. Why don't you show us the product, man? I think a lot of people still haven't tried Chad Finance.

明白了。好，兄弟，给我们演示一下产品吧？我觉得很多人还没用过 ChatGPT Finances。

[3:29] Ethan

Yeah, sounds great.

好啊，没问题。

[3:30] Peter

So, show us how to get to it.

那先给我们看看从哪儿进去。

[3:32] Ethan

So, I'm going to walk through a few different sort of modes and things you can do. I think the first mode that's probably the, you know, the easiest to get started with is I want to show you how anyone can sort of watch ChatgBT pay for itself. And what I mean by that is, you know, today our finances product is included in a plus and pro subscription which costs $20 a month. We've been working to make sure Chat GBT can just pay for itself. So if you pay $20 a month, how do you have it save you or find $20 a month you otherwise didn't know you could do? And so let me start there and then we'll get progressively more complex and more complex and you can leave me wherever you want to continue to go. Peter,

我会带大家过几种不同的模式和玩法。我觉得第一种、大概也是最容易上手的，就是给你们看看，任何人都能眼看着 ChatGPT 把自己的订阅费挣回来。我的意思是：目前我们的 Finances 产品包含在 Plus 和 Pro 订阅里，Plus 每月 20 美元。我们一直在努力，确保 ChatGPT 能直接回本。也就是说，你每月付 20 美元，怎么让它帮你省下、或者找出每月 20 美元——那些你原本都不知道能省的钱？那我就从这里开始，然后一步步往越来越复杂的用法走，你想往哪个方向深入，随时带我过去，Peter。

[4:09]

just have it cancel all the other AI subscriptions. That's the way [laughter]

Peter： 直接让它把其他 AI 订阅全退掉就行了。

Ethan： 这就对了。（笑）

[4:13] Ethan

starting place. If you sign up for chat GPT, sign up for a plus subscription, connect your finances, right? So, use our finances connector to connect your accounts, which I can show you and we can get into that in a sec. Also, I would suggest you connect your email. You can think about it like this. If you connect your financial accounts and you connect your email, chat has all this context to help make sure, right, you're not getting overbuild. When you do get overbuild, it can email the merchant, the biller, for you on your behalf. It can make sure you're not getting double build. it can look at all the subscriptions to see what you're actually using versus what you're not using. And so this is a really important point that these two sort of areas of context, your financial accounts and your email give Chad GPT superpowers to help you get more dialed in with your money to help you save money. And I'll I'll show you what that looks like right here.

起点是这样：注册 ChatGPT，开通 Plus 订阅，然后把你的财务账户连上，对吧？就是用我们的 Finances connector 连接你的账户，这个我可以演示，马上就讲到。另外，我建议你把邮箱也连上。你可以这么理解：财务账户和邮箱都连上之后，ChatGPT 就有了所有这些上下文，能帮你确保不会被多收钱。真被多收了，它可以代表你给商家、给开账单的那一方发邮件。它能确保你没有被重复扣费，还能把你所有的订阅过一遍，看看哪些你真在用、哪些根本没用。所以这一点非常重要：财务账户和邮箱这两块上下文，等于给了 ChatGPT 超能力，帮你把钱管得更精细，帮你省钱。我这就给你看看具体是什么样。

[5:01] Ethan

So this is really simple prompt. Anyone can do this, right? Review the last 90 days for subscriptions. Look at price price increases, duplicate charges, refundable fees, you know, unusually expensive household bills. So, right out the gate, it in my case is like, hey, it looks like this self- storage, this is a fictional character, so bear with me. And some of this data is also synthetic, but uh go along the story with me. Just pretend I'm Jim.

这是个非常简单的 prompt，谁都能用，对吧？「回顾过去 90 天的订阅，看看有没有涨价、重复扣费、可以退的费用，还有贵得出奇的家庭账单。」你看，它一上来就说——在我这个例子里——「嘿，这个自助仓储看起来……」这是个虚构人物，大家将就一下。有些数据也是合成的，不过请跟着我把故事走下去。就当我是 Jim 吧。

[5:24] Ethan

And hey, Jim, you have this potentially duplicate charge, right, for your storage. It looks like you might have been duplicate charged for this hair salon. In this case, I know this was me and then my kids. Look, Evernote recently increased their price. Is this still worth it? Went up from 129 to$2.49. and then checking fees and then some other services that I use. And so from here just very quickly gives you that context. What would take you a lot of time to pull through on your own and I can go back and forth. But what's really powerful and this is me asking about my subscriptions. I'm going to jump down. I then ask chat and I'm like, "Hey, draft an email to self storage. Tell them I've been build twice and then send this off." Yeah. Yeah. And so, you know, I had an example like this in my own life with a hotel that I used points to book it and then they still build me. I had no idea it happened. Chat called it. I had chat deal with their customer service and I ended up getting reimbursed. And this just another example of that.

「嘿，Jim，你的仓储这笔可能是重复扣费。」对吧？「这家美发店你好像也被重复扣了钱。」这笔我知道，其实是我和我孩子们。再看：「Evernote 最近涨价了，还值得续吗？」从 129 美元涨到了 249 美元。接着是支票账户的手续费，还有我用的其他一些服务。所以它一下子就把这些情况摆到你面前了，这些要是你自己去扒，得花很多时间；而且我还可以跟它来回讨论。但真正厉害的是——这里是我在问订阅的事，我往下跳一下——接着我跟 ChatGPT 说：「嘿，给那家自助仓储起草一封邮件，告诉他们我被扣了两次钱，然后发出去。」对，对。我自己生活里就碰到过类似的事：有家酒店，我是用积分订的，结果他们还是扣了我的钱，我完全不知道。是 ChatGPT 揪出来的。我让 ChatGPT 去跟他们的客服交涉，最后钱退回来了。这就是又一个这样的例子。

[6:19] Peter

Nice. I remember I was trying to cancel some hotels for my parents because there's some health issue. And uh yeah, I basically got chat GBT to email the hotel and I I told her to like schedule a task to monitor for any replies and keep going back and forth with the hotel to to get the money back and uh it worked.

不错。我记得有一次，我爸妈身体出了点状况，我得帮他们取消几家酒店。我基本上就是让 ChatGPT 给酒店发邮件，还让它设了个定时任务，盯着有没有回复，一直跟酒店来回沟通，把钱要回来。结果真成了。

[6:36] Peter

Yeah.

对。

[6:36] Ethan

Yes, that's exactly. Yeah. I I'm at this point now where I will almost not interact with any service providers myself.

没错，就是这样。对。我现在基本到了这个地步：几乎不再亲自跟任何服务商打交道了。

[6:46] Ethan

It's all chat GPT over email through their browser, right? when you have to talk to the support agent. Um anyway, we can talk more about that later.

全交给 ChatGPT：发邮件，或者用它的浏览器，对吧？就是需要跟客服人员对话的时候。嗯，总之，这个我们之后可以再细聊。

[6:57] Ethan

So, this one again is just a really great way just right off the bat, you know, to see how chat can pay for itself and how chat can just get you money that you otherwise just might have left leaving around or don't have the energy to deal with or don't want to deal with. Now, let me take a step back and I want to show you some of the finances sort of dashboard you get when you set this up. Does that sound good, Peter?

所以再说一遍，这个用法一上手就能让你看到 ChatGPT 怎么把订阅费挣回来，怎么帮你把钱拿回来——那些钱你原本可能就随手放着不管了，或者没精力处理、不想去处理。好，现在我退一步，给你们看看设置好之后会有的 Finances 仪表盘。这样可以吗，Peter？

[7:22] Peter

Yeah, that sounds great.

好啊，没问题。

[7:23] Ethan

And so, when you do this, you're going to want to tag out finances. You can also go to more and you'll see finances in here. I don't have it because I have it pinned here. That's the other way. If you tap that, it'll help onboard you into the product. But from chat, you can just ask it. And in this case, I have accounts connected. But if you don't have any, you'll see this sort of institution connection widget where you can tap here and connect for the first time. You know, we use Plaid for all of our bank integrations. Plaid's the gold standard for securely connecting your bank to a service. When you're entering in, you know, your login or your password to connect to your bank, none of that's going into chat GPT. That's passing directly to securely to Plaid and then Plaid is interfacing with your bank. I think it's also worth noting when you connect your bank to chat GPT, ChatGpt never gets access to your routing number or account number. It can't move any money. This is sort of just a readonly data connection that chat then has to your bank. I'm not going to connect here, but this kind of shows you some of the familiar Plaid UI to do that.

要用这个功能，你得 @ 一下 Finances。你也可以点「More」，在里面就能看到 Finances。我这里没有，是因为我把它固定在这儿了，这是另一种入口。点一下，它会引导你上手这个产品。不过在对话里直接问它也行。我这个账号已经连好了账户，但如果你一个都还没连，就会看到一个连接金融机构的小组件，点这里就能完成第一次连接。我们所有的银行对接都用 Plaid。Plaid 是把银行安全连接到各类服务的黄金标准。你为了连银行输入登录名或密码的时候，这些信息完全不会进到 ChatGPT，而是直接、安全地传给 Plaid，再由 Plaid 跟你的银行对接。还有一点也值得说明：你把银行连到 ChatGPT 之后，ChatGPT 永远拿不到你的银行路由号（routing number）或账号，它没法动你的任何一分钱。这只是 ChatGPT 跟你银行之间一条只读的数据连接。我这里就不真连了，不过这大概能让你看到大家熟悉的 Plaid 界面是什么样。

[8:30] Peter

Yeah.

嗯。

[8:31]

Once your bank account is connected, you could continue to go back and forth in chat to talk about it. Then you also can just go to the finances tab to get this sort of bird's eyee view of what's happening with your money. This episode is brought to you by Whisperflow. Whisperflow saves me at least 3 hours a week and is one of my favorite AI apps by far. It's just so much faster to dictate to AI using your voice than to type. You just talk naturally and it outputs clean, ready to send text. Whisper Flow even removes filler words and [music] formats your sentences for you. I use Whisperflow for everything, including drafting newsletter posts, writing product specs, replying on Slack, and more. It works on Mac, Windows, iPhone, and Android across all of your favorite apps. Try a free at whisperflow.com and use my code peter whispererflow to get 6 months free. That's Peter Whisperflow. Now, back to our episode. Let me ask you this before we move on. So, Chad uses Plaid, which is used by a lot of other fintech providers, too. I think just like normal people are just worried that like chatbt will learn that I only have $8,000 in my bank account or [laughter] something or like I'm spend a lot of money on this and that and um can you give some reassurances about like you know training on this financial data or something is that

Ethan： 银行账户连好之后，你可以继续在对话里跟它来回聊这些。另外也可以直接去 Finances 标签页，鸟瞰一下你的钱整体是什么情况。

Peter： 本期节目由 Wispr Flow 赞助。Wispr Flow 每周至少帮我省下 3 个小时，是我目前最喜欢的 AI 应用之一。用语音跟 AI 口述，比打字快太多了。你只要自然地说话，它就能输出干净、可以直接发出去的文字。Wispr Flow 还会帮你去掉口头禅、把句子排好版。我什么都用 Wispr Flow：起草 newsletter、写产品 spec、在 Slack 上回消息等等。它支持 Mac、Windows、iPhone 和 Android，在你常用的各种 App 里都能用。去 wisprflow.com 免费试用，用我的优惠码 peterwisprflow 可以免费用 6 个月。优惠码就是 peterwisprflow。好，回到我们的节目。继续往下之前，我想问你一个问题。ChatGPT 用的是 Plaid，很多其他金融科技公司也在用它。我觉得普通人就是会担心，ChatGPT 会知道我银行账户里只有 8000 美元（笑），或者知道我在这个那个上面花了一大堆钱。嗯，关于拿这些财务数据做训练之类的事，你能不能给大家一些保证？是……

[9:42] Ethan

yeah yeah I'm happy to happy to talk through this a little bit so there's a couple things to just sort of pull apart when you connect your bank account to chat GPT you know chatbt will download those transactions from your bank account or your balances in order to enrich them and enriching literally means give proper categorization. So you can have a great you know spending categorization widget like this. It will detect subscriptions and sort of just using intelligence to connect dots amongst your transactions. That raw financial data of your transactions or your balances is never used for training. That'll sort of sit in a secure store. It sits there and it's not not used in any way for training. Now there's a nuance here where if you're in a conversation talking about you know spending on Door Dash and talking about Door Dash enters a conversation if it in a conversation that could be used for training. So I think it's an important distinction and as a consumer you have the ability to turn training off and so you can go to settings and you can turn training off for your conversations which would then ensure that we also can't train even when that data would enter your conversation. And so you have full control over what you're comfortable with.

好，好，我很乐意聊聊这个。这里有几件事得拆开来说。你把银行账户连到 ChatGPT 之后，ChatGPT 会从你的银行账户下载交易记录或余额，用来做 enrich（数据加工）——enrich 说白了就是给它们打上准确的分类，这样你才能有像这样好用的消费分类小组件。它会识别出订阅，也会用智能把你各笔交易之间的关联串起来。你的交易、余额这些原始财务数据永远不会被用来训练。它们会放在一个安全的存储里，就待在那儿，不会以任何方式用于训练。不过这里有个细微差别：如果你在对话里聊，比如说你在 DoorDash 上的花销，DoorDash 这件事进入了对话，那这段对话是可能被用于训练的。所以我觉得这是个重要的区别。而作为用户，你可以把训练关掉：去设置里把你对话的训练开关关掉，这样即使这些数据进入了你的对话，我们也没法拿去训练。所以你能接受到什么程度，完全由你自己掌控。

[10:55] Peter

Great. Yeah. Thanks. Thanks for that reassurance.

好的。谢谢，谢谢你给大家吃了颗定心丸。

[10:57] Ethan

Yeah. And so from the dashboard, you know, there's a couple familiar things that if you used a financial product before will seem familiar, right? You can see your spending by category, which we're sort of breaking down for you. You can change this if you want to see it month over month.

嗯。在仪表盘上，有几样东西，如果你以前用过理财产品，应该会觉得眼熟，对吧？你可以按类别看消费，我们会帮你拆分好。如果想看逐月的变化，也可以切换。

[11:12] Ethan

You can drill into a category. So I'll like go back to August. Okay. What's dining and drinks? I'll collapse this so we can see more. And this will give me a readout of, you know, what's basically been happening in this category, even calling out like what my larger subcategory was. And then you can see the subcategories within there. And you can see recent transactions it considered to be uh dining and drinks.

你可以点进某个类别往下钻。比如我回到 8 月。好，Dining & Drinks（餐饮酒水）是什么情况？我把这个收起来，好多看一点。它会给我一份解读，讲讲这个类别里大体发生了什么，甚至会点出我哪个子类别花得最多。然后你能看到里面的各个子类别，还能看到它归到餐饮酒水里的最近几笔交易。

[11:37] Peter

Nice.

不错。

[11:38] Ethan

If you keep going down, you'll get a net worth widget. Um, and it's worth mentioning if you're in just regular chat talking, you'll see these widgets also show up. You don't have to come to the finances tab to see these, but the finances tab is a helpful way to quickly get that bird's eye view of what's happening with your money.

继续往下拉，会看到一个净资产小组件。嗯，值得一提的是，就算你只是在普通聊天里对话，这些小组件也会冒出来。你不用非得跑到 Finances 标签页才能看到它们，不过想快速鸟瞰一下自己的钱是什么状况，Finances 标签页很好用。

[11:56] Ethan

If I've connected investment accounts, which I did in this case, you sort of get this daily mover widget. You can see sort of your upcoming incoming and outgoing cash flow or or subscriptions or u bills. If it's not sure about a transaction and what category it is, it will do its best job guessing. But if it's can't figure it out, you'll get this category review widget where you can tell it, you know, what this is.

如果我连了投资账户——这个例子里我连了——就会看到这个每日涨跌（daily movers）小组件。你还能看到接下来的现金流入和流出，或者订阅、账单。如果它对某笔交易拿不准、不确定该归到哪个类别，它会尽量去猜。但要是实在判断不出来，你就会看到这个分类确认（category review）小组件，你可以在这里告诉它这笔到底是什么。

[12:29] Peter

And I guess tell through chat or something or

我猜也可以在聊天里告诉它之类的？或者……

[12:31] Ethan

you could also do it through chat. Th

也可以在聊天里告诉它。这……

[12:33] Ethan

this [clears throat] one actually will be through UI. You can, you know, make a change here. But if I was doing this in chat, I could literally just say like ax find hotels. that's hotels and it would update that category for me.

这个其实是在 UI 里改的，你可以直接在这里改。但如果是在聊天里，我真的只要说一句「Amex Fine Hotels，这笔是酒店」，它就会帮我把类别更新好。

[12:45] Peter

I remember I don't think it was CHB finance. I remember using like another provider and they classified Mancinis as Italian restaurant but it's actually a mattress orderer that I got. [laughter] It's like a $4,000 bill. So yeah, I had to for sure.

我记得——应该不是 ChatGPT Finances——我记得是用另一家服务的时候，它把 Mancini's 归成了意大利餐厅，可那其实是我下单买的床垫。（笑）那可是一笔 4,000 美元的账单。所以那次我肯定得手动改过来。

[12:59] Ethan

Yeah, we you know I've been working as I said in in consumer fintech for a long time because we're using models and sort of frontier intelligence to categorize. It's the best I've ever seen out of the box. like connect your account

是啊，就像我说的，我在消费金融科技这行做了很久。因为我们是用模型、用前沿智能来做分类，这是我见过开箱即用效果最好的。就是你连上账户，

[13:13] Ethan

and you'll just see accurate categorizations. That being said, there are oneoffs like that that will still happen and we're working hard to make this even better and better. And there's also cases where, you know, you might think something is shopping, but I think it's services and that's just really hard for us to guess and get right. And so there will still be, you know, some categorization if you want there to be. But out of the box, you'll get a lot of accuracy even if you do nothing.

就能看到准确的分类。话虽如此，像你说的那种个例还是会发生，我们也在努力把它做得越来越好。还有一些情况，比如你觉得某笔算购物，我却觉得算服务，这种我们就真的很难猜对。所以如果你愿意，还是会有一些需要你自己动手分类的地方。但开箱即用的情况下，就算你什么都不做，准确率也已经很高了。

[13:37]

Awesome. you know, we'll we'll surface fees and interests and then you'll sort of start getting this account breakdown and asset allocation widgets as well. Um, in this case, I don't think I've connected enough accounts to go to the next detail. So, from a dashboard, you know, a lot of what you'd want is here, but this requires you to come into the app, go to this dashboard, and ask these questions. So, it sort of requires more work from you. And so what we've also done is when you sign up for the finances product in chat GPT, you'll automatically get a sort of weekly finances update that will get sent to you proactively. And this will get either pushed to you over email andor you'll get a push notification. And you can turn this off if you don't want it. But we find that users love this because, you know, it'll be the weekend, they'll have a moment, they'll get this push and all of a sudden they're in this place and I'll just show you what it looks like where they're getting an update sort of week over week. How's my spending so far this month versus last month? We'll just come to you in terms of my spending. What have I been spending on? And you'll kind of get this similar widget. And then also, what's been happening with my net worth and my investments?

Peter： 太棒了。

Ethan： 我们还会把手续费和利息单独拎出来，然后你还会看到账户明细和资产配置这些小组件。嗯，这个例子里我连的账户好像还不够多，展开不到下一层细节。所以说，仪表盘上已经有你想要的大部分东西了，但这需要你打开 App、进到这个仪表盘、再去问这些问题，等于要你多费点事。所以我们还做了一件事：你在 ChatGPT 里开通 Finances 之后，会自动收到一份每周财务简报（Weekly Finances Update），主动发给你。它会通过邮件发给你，和/或给你发推送通知。不想要的话可以关掉。但我们发现用户很喜欢它，因为比如到了周末，他们正好有点空，收到这条推送，一下子就点进来了。我给你看看它长什么样，他们会收到一份周环比的更新：我这个月到目前为止的花销跟上个月比怎么样？花销方面的情况它会直接推给你。我都花在哪儿了？你会看到一个类似的小组件。然后还有：我的净资产和投资最近怎么样了？

[14:53] Ethan

And then lastly, if it thinks there's things you could be doing or take action on, it'll give you suggestions like you see here at the bottom.

最后，如果它觉得有些事你可以去做、可以采取行动，它就会给你提建议，就像你在底部这里看到的。

[14:59] Peter

Yeah, this is great. Yeah.

嗯，这个太棒了。嗯。

[15:02] Peter

So, so I'll just get like a notification on chat GP on my phone and like check check this out. Right.

所以我就会在手机上收到 ChatGPT 的通知，然后点开看一眼，对吧。

[15:07] Ethan

Exactly. You don't need to do anything. You just sit back.

没错。你什么都不用做，坐等就行。

[15:10] Ethan

And what's cool is some of these suggestions you could actually have chat GPT do or follow up for you on. I mean, in this case, I don't think these would work, but sometimes the suggested action will be applying for something, cancelling something, and you can be like, "Hey, like, take care of that for me." And it will go off and it will attempt to do that for you on your behalf.

更酷的是，其中有些建议你其实可以直接让 ChatGPT 去做，或者替你跟进。当然，这个例子里的这几条我觉得不太行，但有时候建议的行动会是去申请某样东西、取消某样东西，你就可以说：「嘿，这事帮我搞定。」它就会去替你尝试把这件事办了。

[15:28] Peter

Got it. What if I want to set up a a triggered a triggered task where if my wife buys too much Amazon.com stuff, it just sensor [laughter] it just sensor ego saying like, "Hey, stop stop buying stuff."

懂了。那如果我想设一个触发式任务呢？比如我老婆在 Amazon.com 上买太多东西，它就直接给她发（笑）直接给她发条消息说：「嘿，别再买东西了。」

[15:39] Ethan

You could you could do that. You could do that. Even in fact, I'll show you this really quick example. Um, this Door Dash one. So, I spend a lot on Door Dash or Jim does in this case. So, I'm just like first talking to Chad. I'm like, "Hey, how much have I been spending on Door Dash?" Okay, here's this graph that it's built for me over the last six months. Okay, TLDDR, too much money spent on Door Dash.

可以，可以这么做。事实上，我给你看个很快的例子。嗯，这个 DoorDash 的。我在 DoorDash 上花了很多钱——这里是 Jim 花了很多。所以我先跟 ChatGPT 聊，我问：「嘿，我在 DoorDash 上花了多少钱？」好，这是它给我做的过去六个月的图表。好吧，TL;DR：在 DoorDash 上花的钱太多了。

[16:00] Ethan

So, down here, I'm like, "Okay, please notify me when I'm approaching, 1500 in a month." And, you know, give me a heads up. And so, that's what it's doing right here.

所以在下面我说：「好，我一个月快花到 1500 美元的时候提醒我。」就是提前给我打个招呼。它现在做的就是这个。

[16:09] Peter

I see.

明白了。

[16:10] Ethan

And you could create I mean, you could create this notification for anything. It could be spending category. It could be transaction. It could be balances in account. It is very flexible based on what's important to you. And this goes back to what you said at the beginning. You know, what's possible now that wasn't it's meeting everyone where they are doing exactly what they need when it comes to their money.

你可以——我是说，你可以给任何东西设这种提醒。可以是某个消费类别，可以是某笔交易，也可以是账户余额。它非常灵活，全看什么对你重要。这又回到你一开始说的那个问题：现在有什么是以前做不到的？那就是在钱这件事上，它能贴合每个人的实际情况，精准地做他们需要的事。

[16:29] Peter

And and how often uh is this data updated like my bank account data or something like is it based on my requests or is it updated on a regular basis?

那这些数据多久更新一次？比如我的银行账户数据之类的，是我发请求的时候才更新，还是定期更新？

[16:38] Ethan

So, it's updated on a regular basis. Each bank's a little bit different. You know, we again work with rely on Plaid for all bank data and I believe Plaid will re try and refresh your account several times per day and when they get a refresh, they'll sort of send us a ping and we'll come and grab new data when it comes in.

是定期更新的。每家银行都略有不同。还是那句话，所有银行数据我们都依靠 Plaid。我记得 Plaid 每天会尝试刷新你的账户好几次，每次一刷新，他们就会给我们发个通知，有新数据进来我们就去拉取。

[16:55] Ethan

So, it should be updating multiple times a day.

所以应该是一天更新好几次。

[16:57] Peter

And um just for the people who are like token conscious like so you don't have to use like so max to do all this stuff. You can just use because I guess it's just reading financial data, right? It's not actually making any changes.

还有，嗯，给那些比较在意 token 用量的人说一句：做这些事不用非得开 Sol Max，直接用就行，因为我猜它只是在读取财务数据，对吧？并不会真的改动什么。

[17:07] Peter

Yeah.

嗯。

[17:08] Ethan

Yeah. Yeah. Everything I'm showing you so far, again, if you're on a plus plan, it's not going to any come anywhere close to hitting any of your usage limits.

对，对。到目前为止我给你演示的所有东西，还是那句话，只要你是 Plus 套餐，离触及任何用量上限都还差得远。

[17:17] Peter

Okay, got it. Great. Cool. [snorts]

好，明白了。太好了，酷。

[17:19] Ethan

So, let me move from, you know, we we covered this sort of really quick ways if you sign up for this to have chat GPT pay for itself. I want to move from there and talk about things that are other ways to have chat help you save money or be a little bit smarter with your money. And these sort of somewhat get progressively more difficult. And then I want to go over this bucket of just when you're making like for me personally when I'm making certain big financial decisions. Now

那我接着往下讲。我们刚才讲了开通之后让 ChatGPT 把自己的订阅费赚回来的几种很快的办法。接下来我想讲讲别的办法，让 ChatGPT 帮你省钱，或者让你在钱的事情上更聪明一点，这些会一步步变得更有难度。然后我还想讲讲另一类：就是在做——拿我自己来说——在做一些重大财务决策的时候。现在，

[17:50] Ethan

there's nothing I will sort of make a decision about before I talk it through with chat. And I want to show you also what that looks like if that sounds good.

任何决定我都一定会先跟 ChatGPT 聊一遍再做。如果你觉得可以的话，我也想给你演示一下这是什么样子。

[17:57] Peter

That sounds great. Yeah. I I can't wait to do the tax plan by anyone. Yeah,

听起来很棒。我已经等不及看税务规划那个了。嗯，

[18:00] Ethan

that's where we're going next. That's where we're going next. You read my mind. Everyone's favorite thing to do. No. So, really basic prompt, right? Again, I've connected my financial accounts. In this case, um this is not as reliant on email, but again, having email does help because it can use that for cross contact understanding, especially if you have a CPA or you're getting, you know, um tax d tax sort of information sent to your email. just makes chat even smarter at helping you. So, really straightforward prompt, right? Help me figure out the best way to optimize taxes based on my current situation.

接下来正要讲这个，接下来正要讲这个。你真会读心。大家最爱干的事嘛——才怪。好，一个很基础的 prompt，对吧？还是一样，我已经连好了财务账户。这个用例没那么依赖邮箱，但连上邮箱还是有帮助，因为它能借此做跨上下文的理解，尤其是如果你有注册会计师，或者你会收到发到邮箱里的税务……税务之类的信息，这会让 ChatGPT 帮你帮得更聪明。所以 prompt 很直白，对吧？「根据我目前的情况，帮我想想怎样最好地优化税务。」

[18:33] Ethan

Okay, it crunched in this case for two minutes and it comes back and it has immediate recommendations for my case.

好，这次它算了两分钟，回来就针对我的情况给出了马上可以执行的建议。

[18:42] Ethan

And you know, for me, I don't have the attention span to always read all of this. And so I'll flip [clears throat] through this and I'll look for the big buckets, but then I'm actually um asking like, okay, how much money could this actually save me? I want to know if this is worth my time, right? So this case, it's telling me how much this might actually save me in taxes depending on my tax bracket. Then I'm like, okay, that's all great. Like, make me an image and tell me what's up here.

不过对我来说，我没那个耐心每次都把这些全读完。所以我会快速翻一遍，找几个大块，然后我其实会问：好，这到底能帮我省多少钱？我想知道这值不值得我花时间，对吧？所以这里它告诉我，按我的税率档位，这些实际大概能帮我省多少税。然后我就说：好，都挺好，给我做张图，告诉我这里面到底是怎么回事。

[19:08] Ethan

And so this is me just like quickly visualizing here are the different ways I could save on taxes ordered by potential impact. And even it will show me down here there's things I shouldn't even consider because the impact may not be big enough.

这就是我快速做的可视化：这些是我可以省税的不同方式，按潜在影响大小排序。它甚至还在下面告诉我，有些方法我根本不用考虑，因为影响可能不够大。

[19:22] Peter

Wow, this is great. Yeah. Is this a pretty common pattern that you use to like understand something without read through everything?

哇，这个太棒了。这是你常用的套路吗？不用把所有东西通读一遍，就能搞懂一件事。

[19:28] Ethan

Yes. Yes. I'll either do Yeah, I'll do an image um and I'll show in a different one or I'll have chat actually visualize it and that will just be like in the chat conversation it can use these rich visualizations to help make things easier to digest.

是的，是的。我要么——对，我会让它做张图，嗯，我在另一个例子里会给你看；要么让 ChatGPT 直接做可视化，那就是在聊天对话里，它能用这些丰富的可视化形式，让内容更容易消化。

[19:44]

Got it. And then if it's more complex, I'll have it make me a site.

Peter： 懂了。

Ethan： 然后如果更复杂一些，我会让它给我做个网站。

[19:48] Ethan

Or if it's something I'm going to sit down and talk through with my wife, I'll also have it make me a site.

或者如果是要跟我太太坐下来一起商量的事，我也会让它给我做个网站。

[19:52] Peter

That that makes sense. That makes sense. Yeah.

有道理，有道理。嗯。

[19:54] Ethan

So, but still for me, right, this still feels like too much work. Like, okay, great. I'll potentially save, you know, $6,000, which is insane, but still too much work. So, I'm like, chat, make yourself a to-do list on what I need to do to actually get these next steps done. And so here it is making me my to-do list to go through this. And then what I would do from here is on my phone or you know in these sort of micro moments in the day I would ask it to sort of take that next step on the to-do list. Some of that might be asking me for information giving it access to documents or letting it go do something with cloud browser to go take those next actions. But I would push chat as far as it can until it needs me to final review something or file something or contact someone.

不过对我来说，这还是太费事了。好吧，很好，我可能能省下 6,000 美元，这很夸张，但还是太费事。所以我就说：ChatGPT，你自己列个待办清单，写清楚我要做哪些事才能真正把这些后续步骤落实。于是它就在这里给我列待办清单。接下来我会在手机上，或者在一天里那些零碎的空档，让它去推进待办清单上的下一步。其中有些可能是向我要信息、让我给它开放文档的访问权限，或者让它用云端浏览器去执行接下来的操作。总之我会让 ChatGPT 能推多远推多远，直到需要我做最后审核、提交某样东西或者联系某个人为止。

[20:39] Peter

Got it. So, you make a to-do list, but then you tell to do all the work, basically. [laughter] Yes. Do

懂了。所以你先列个待办清单，然后基本上就让它把所有活都干了。（笑）对，去做

[20:44] Peter

the to-do list.

待办清单上的事。

[20:45] Ethan

And the to-do Exactly. And the to-do list helps me, you know, I'm I'm not maybe a tax expert. I'm not, but it helps me understand what it's suggesting in a more digestible format. And it helps me keep track of where we are in the process. And it helps chat GBT keep track of where it is in the process because this is now an artifact, you know, you could reference from any tax, any chat conversation, excuse me. And you can come back into the same chat and tell it to go the next step or you could be somewhere else and it can reference it and go to the next step.

而且待办——没错。而且待办清单能帮到我：我可能不是税务专家——我确实不是——但它能用更好消化的形式帮我理解它在建议什么；还能帮我记着我们进行到了哪一步；也能帮 ChatGPT 记着它自己进行到了哪一步，因为它现在是一个 artifact，你可以在任何一个报税……不好意思，任何一个聊天对话里引用它。你可以回到同一个对话里让它进行下一步，也可以在别的对话里，它能引用这份清单，然后推进下一步。

[21:14] Peter

Got it. And do you also like uh let your accountant see some of the stuff or like kind of like how do you share this stuff with your accountant?

懂了。那你会让你的会计师也看看这些东西吗？或者说，你是怎么把这些东西分享给会计师的？

[21:20] Ethan

Yeah, typically my workflow will be like my accountant is emailing me has some questions. I will actually have you know chat uh read that email, tell me what it needs for me. Sometimes it needs some documents, sometimes it needs an answer. I'll have it grab the documents, draft the response. In some cases, I'll just let it send the response because it makes sense to me. In other cases, I'll check it and then let it send to my CPA.

嗯，我一般的流程是这样：我的会计师发邮件给我，问了一些问题。我会让 ChatGPT 读那封邮件，告诉我对方需要我提供什么。有时候是要一些文件，有时候是要一个答复。我会让它把文件找出来、把回复起草好。有些情况下，我觉得回复没问题，就直接让它发了；另一些情况下，我会先检查一遍，再让它发给我的注册会计师。

[21:43] Peter

Got it. Yeah, dude. Like just from my personal taxes, like yeah, I have no idea about how to save money on taxes either. And a couple of areas where it saved me time is my accountant asked me for like all these like income statements and blah blah blah, right? Like here's like a list of all these income statements. So, I usually ask uh Chad P looking in my Google Drive to find all the stuff or like try to find it from the websites that I use. That took a ton of time. Um,

懂了。是啊，老兄。就拿我自己的个人报税来说，我也完全不知道怎么省税。它帮我省时间的地方有几个：一个是我的会计师找我要一大堆收入证明之类的东西，对吧？比如给我一张清单，上面列着所有这些收入证明。所以我一般会让 ChatGPT 去我的 Google Drive 里把这些东西都找出来，或者去我用的那些网站上找。这活儿本来特别费时间。嗯，

[22:07] Ethan

amazing. You're on the frontier.

太厉害了。你走在最前沿啊。

[22:08] Peter

On the frontier. Yeah. And another time is like this. He sent me like a This is probably bad, but he sent me like a my my business's tax statement. It's like 50 plus pages and it's like, "Hey, Peter, can you review this? I have no idea what was going on here." So, just

最前沿，对。还有一次是这样：他发给我一份——这么说可能不太好——他发给我一份我公司的税务报表，有 50 多页，然后说：「嘿 Peter，你能审一下吗？」我完全看不懂这里面是怎么回事。所以就……

[22:23] Ethan

we all get CPA.

我们都收到过注册会计师发来的这种东西。

[22:25] Ethan

Yeah.

是啊。

[22:25] Peter

Yeah.

对。

[22:26] Peter

Like, I'm gonna look through 50 pages of this, you know?

我难道还真去翻这 50 页吗，你懂吧？

[22:28] Ethan

Yes. And even if we even when we do,

是啊。而且就算我们——就算我们真去看了，

[22:31] Ethan

we don't know what we're reading.

也看不懂自己在读什么。

[22:33] Ethan

Yeah. You know what I mean? Like we we don't have the time to figure this out to depth and get Yeah.

对吧。你懂我意思吧？我们根本没时间去深入把这些搞明白，再去……嗯。

[22:40] Ethan

Your your pattern and your usage is is common among people who are comfortable right with these tools.

你这种模式、这种用法，在用惯了这些工具的人当中很普遍。

[22:46] Ethan

Everyone's doing this now

现在大家都这么干，

[22:48]

because it's more rigorous and it saves us time. I also think like uh accountants depending on how good your accountant is like they don't actually proactively help you save money on taxes throughout the year, right? They come at the end and they're like, "Hey, you got to pay your t taxes now." So like so actually like chat GP can be more proactive.

Ethan： 因为这样更严谨，也能省下我们的时间。

Peter： 我还觉得吧，会计师——当然也要看你的会计师水平如何——他们其实不会在一年当中主动帮你省税，对吧？他们都是到最后才出现，说：「嘿，你现在得交税了。」所以其实 ChatGPT 可以更主动。

[23:05] Ethan

Yeah,

对，

[23:05] Ethan

that's right. 100%. There's like you know we talk about this a little internally. If you're using you know chat to its max in some ways you're getting you know you're getting a whole bunch of abilities that even people with you know 5 10 20 plus million dollars aren't getting from their service providers. Like that level of detail, care, rigor, and help is available to everyone now.

没错，百分之百。我们内部其实也聊过这个：如果你把 ChatGPT 用到极致，某种程度上你拿到的是一整套能力——就连身家 500 万、1000 万乃至 2000 多万美元的人，都没能从他们的服务机构那里得到。那种细致、用心、严谨和帮助，现在人人都能享受到了。

[23:32] Peter

Yeah, that's amazing. Yeah, maybe you can prompt it like, "Hey, pretend I'm a billionaire. Help me save [laughter] all the money on my taxes." Yeah.

对，太厉害了。对，你甚至可以这么写 prompt：「嘿，假装我是个亿万富翁，帮我把税钱全省下来。」（笑）对。

[23:40] Ethan

I did. Yeah. And in tax, I'll just like highlight this as well just from my own experience. You know, a lot of a lot of people will focus on, you know, their investments and where am I going to get alpha and how's it allocated and they'll sweat all this stuff because it's sexy. I mean, investing is interesting. It's the reason, you know, people like it. But for most people, the most money that they could be saving or impacting their life is all in their taxes.

我还真试过。对。说到税，我也想结合自己的经历强调一点：很多很多人会盯着自己的投资——我去哪儿找 alpha（超额收益）、资产怎么配置——为这些事操碎了心，因为投资够性感。我是说，投资确实有意思，这也是大家喜欢它的原因。但对大多数人来说，最能省钱、对生活影响最大的那部分，全在税上。

[24:04]

People are underoptimizing their taxes. And it compounds every single year. And there's no risk with those decisions in the sort of classic risk sense like there is an investment that you're making. Mhm. And just so like for people who are not in the US, the way it's able to find all this stuff is just looking at the IRS website or something and like you know if I'm in Canada can can also get us benefit.

Ethan： 大家的税普遍都没优化到位，而且这个损失每年都在复利累积。更何况这类决策不存在经典意义上的那种风险，不像你做一笔投资那样有风险。

Peter： 嗯。那顺便问一下，对不在美国的人来说……它之所以能找到这些东西，是不是就是去查 IRS（美国国税局）网站之类的？比如我要是在加拿大，也能享受到这个好处吗？

[24:25]

Yeah.

嗯。

[24:26] Ethan

Yeah. Yeah. I think so caveat that the finances tool today and the finances app is only available to users. So you won't be able to connect your financial accounts to chat but you would still right be able to connect Google Drive that has stuff in it. You would be able to connect your email. You would be able to use, you know, model intelligence to help answer questions. Again, the model will use web search to help answer questions more accurately that are more relevant and timely. So, all of that's available, you know, wherever you are in the world.

对，对，我觉得可以。不过要先说明一下：目前 Finances 这个工具、这个 Finances 应用只对美国用户开放。所以你没法把自己的金融账户连到 ChatGPT 上，但你仍然可以连接存着相关资料的 Google Drive，可以连接你的邮箱，可以借助模型本身的智能来回答问题。而且模型会联网搜索，让回答更准确、更贴切、更及时。所以这些功能，不管你身在世界哪个地方都能用。

[24:53] Peter

Got it. Okay, cool, man. This is super helpful. Yeah.

明白了。好，酷，哥们，这太有用了。嗯。

[24:56] Ethan

Okay. So, let's move to So, this is really easy, really fast. If you connect your brokerage accounts, your IRA, send chat this prompt, right? Analyze my ETFs, mutual funds. Are there any replacement funds that could be cheaper? This is going to be a really fast way to know if you're, you know, buying some mutual fund or ETF where there's a comparable one that's the exact same but lower fee and becomes almost a no-brainer to swap into it.

好，那我们接着看——这个特别简单、特别快。如果你连接了券商账户、你的 IRA（个人退休账户），就给 ChatGPT 发这条 prompt，对吧：「分析一下我的 ETF 和共同基金，有没有更便宜的替代基金？」这能让你特别快地知道：你买的某只共同基金或 ETF，是不是有一只一模一样、只是费率更低的可比基金——那换过去几乎就是不用想的事。

[25:24] Ethan

Uh, and we also see depending if you have a human advisor or not or a human broker,

呃，而且我们还发现，要看你有没有真人理财顾问，或者真人经纪人，

[25:29] Ethan

sometimes they don't even know that you're in some fund of fund that has these ETFs that have really high fees. And so this is another quick check and it'll compare it. It'll look for comparables, right? It'll estimate your annual savings uh if you were to flip. But again, really good check just to make sure you're not leaving money on the table in regards to any of your brokerage accounts or IAS.

有时候连他们都不知道，你买的某只基金中的基金（FOF）里装着这些费率特别高的 ETF。所以这又是一个快速体检：它会帮你做比较、找可比基金，对吧？还会估算如果你换过去，每年能省多少钱。总之，这是个很好的检查，确保你在任何券商账户或 IRA 上都没有白白漏掉本该省下的钱。

[25:49] Peter

Yeah, my my my parents are investing in mutual funds and they can probably save a lot of money in this. Just switch to ETFs.

对，我爸妈就在买共同基金，在这上面估计能省下不少钱，直接换成 ETF 就行。

[25:55] Ethan

They should you should run this for them.

他们应该……你应该帮他们跑一下这个。

[25:56] Peter

Yeah.

好。

[25:57] Ethan

See them see them next.

下次见到他们的时候。

[25:59] Peter

Yeah.

嗯。

[26:00] Ethan

Okay. So let's move to a little bit more I wouldn't say complex but sort of less frequent sort of higher stakes. Actually before I do that I I lied. Let me go to this other one. So a lot of people like optimizing their credit card rewards even if you're not going to spend a lot of time. There's some people that will go extremely deep and spend an incredible amount of time but I would encourage people to just spend you know five minutes six minutes took to run. Another prompt, right? Analyze how I've been using my credit cards. Am I using them in the best way? Right, to maximize my rewards.

好，那我们来看一些稍微……我不会说更复杂，而是频率更低、但分量更重的事。其实在那之前——我刚才说错了，先看另一个。很多人喜欢优化自己的信用卡回馈，哪怕并不打算在上面花很多时间。有些人会钻得特别深，花掉大把大把的时间，但我建议大家就花个五六分钟——跑一遍也就这么久。又是一条 prompt，对吧：「分析一下我一直以来是怎么用信用卡的，我的用法是不是最优？」对，目标是把回馈最大化。

[26:35] Ethan

And chat will look at your cards,

然后 ChatGPT 会看你有哪些卡，

[26:38] Ethan

look at your spending, look at the categories you're spending on, understand the member benefits for your card, understand its reward structure, understand points value, and then tell you if there's anything you should be changing about the credit cards you already have so you can get more more value out of them.

看你的消费、看你都花在哪些类别上，弄清楚你那张卡的会员权益、回馈结构和积分价值，然后告诉你：你手上已有的这些信用卡，用法上有没有该调整的地方，好让它们给你带来更多价值。

[26:55] Peter

Oh, that that's amazing. So, it will look at all the card statements and everything and try to figure this out, right? Yeah.

哦，这太厉害了。所以它会把所有信用卡账单什么的都看一遍，然后自己把这些理清楚，对吧？嗯。

[26:59] Ethan

Yeah. In this case, it's really just looking at transactions and uh if you have your email connected, it can also be looking at member benefits like AX has these benefits. Are you using them? Well, it'll know if you're not because you didn't get the email saying you activated it. And it'll say, oh, you should turn this clear benefit on or this TSA pre-check benefit.

对。在这个例子里，它其实主要就是看交易记录；呃，如果你还连接了邮箱，它也能去看会员权益——比如 Amex 有这些权益，你用上了吗？你要是没用，它是知道的，因为你从没收到过「已激活」的那封邮件。然后它会告诉你：哦，你该把这个 CLEAR（机场快速安检）权益打开，或者这个 TSA PreCheck 权益。

[27:16] Peter

Got it. Got it.

懂了，懂了。

[27:17] Ethan

And from here is what I was talking to. I'm scrolling through here. Let me just go to this last one where I was prompting. But in this case, I wanted a visualization. And so I just ask it, hey, please visualize this for me. And now you get sort of this visualization of I have this sort of intricate case where I have a credit card that has a 4% reward structure, but only up to $10,000. And it's telling me earlier last year I was going way above that. And so I wasn't getting the rewards. And you can see I figured that on my own, then I brought that spend down. And now I'm almost never hitting that limit.

接下来就是我刚才说的那部分。我往下滚一下……我直接跳到最后我发 prompt 的这条。不过这次我想要一个可视化，所以我就跟它说：「嘿，帮我把这个可视化一下。」然后你就会看到这样一张图。我这个情况有点复杂：我有一张信用卡，回馈是 4%，但只限前 10,000 美元的消费。它告诉我，去年早些时候我的消费远远超过了这个额度，所以超出的部分拿不到回馈。你也能看到，后来我自己发现了这一点，就把那张卡上的消费降了下来，结果现在我几乎从来碰不到那个上限。

[27:49] Ethan

So I might be leaving something on the table here.

所以在这儿我可能白白错过了一些回馈。

[27:52] Ethan

And so that's one part. And then it's telling me where to move spend, right? In terms of this AAX general spend, I should move to a cashback cart. And again, if you go down to here, it's showing me why it's making those recommendations and how much money.

这是一部分。然后它还告诉我该把消费挪到哪儿，对吧？比如这张 Amex 上的一般消费，我应该挪到一张返现卡上。再往下看，它还告诉我它为什么给出这些建议，以及能多拿多少钱。

[28:07] Ethan

Yeah. Could be better off with, right? This is like a $2,900 potential gain

对，本来能多拿这么多，对吧？这差不多是 2,900 美元的潜在收益，

[28:11] Ethan

just on rewards in this case.

而且这还只算了回馈这一项。

[28:13] Peter

Wow. Wow. I I should make a Chach site with like, you know, credit card reward powered by Chacht.

哇，哇。我真该做个网站，就那种由 ChatGPT 驱动的信用卡回馈优化。

[28:19] Ethan

You could.

确实可以。

[28:19] Peter

That would be very useful. Yeah. What else? What about this thing? take time off.

那会非常有用。嗯。还有什么？这个呢——「休一段假」？

[28:23] Ethan

Does that resonate with you? I mean, you're not really taking time off, though.

这个你有共鸣吗？不过我是说，你其实也没真在休假。

[28:26] Ethan

You're working your ass off.

你可是在拼老命干活。

[28:28] Peter

Uh, you know, my my schedule's pretty flexible. So, yeah.

呃，其实我的时间安排挺灵活的。所以，嗯。

[28:32] Ethan

So, you know, for for people who may or may not watch The Office, there's a case where like Jim's thinking about taking time off uh to pursue a startup. He's not taking time off. He's about changing his job. So, this isn't the perfect analog for that, but I basically created, you know, a prompt, which is, I'm thinking about taking six months off. Build me an interactive site to help me think through this. I want three scenarios. I gave it a little bit of detail on how much I think I would be spending and still making in that new world being that my wife would still be working.

给看过或没看过美剧《The Office》（办公室）的朋友说一下：剧里有一段，Jim 在考虑停下工作一段时间去搞创业。其实他并不是休假，而是要换工作。所以这不是个完美的类比，但我基本上就写了这么一条 prompt：「我在考虑休息六个月，给我做一个交互式网站，帮我把这件事想清楚。我要三种情景。」我还给了它一点细节：在那种新状态下，我估计自己会花多少钱、还能挣多少钱——因为我妻子还会继续上班。

[29:00] Peter

Okay.

好。

[29:00] Ethan

And you know, it runs this and then it gives me this. I'll flip over to here. This is another one. And it's a really easy way to visually understand what these different paths mean for your savings. And in this case, I want to make sure I don't ever go below this $21,000 in savings. And I can see like not only can I take that six months off, I can use some of my cash to fund my small business or startup idea, which again is this still orange one. I get the lowest, but I still don't get down to three-month reserve. Over here, I'm like, you know what? What if it was seven months off? What if it was eight months off, nine months? And because I have these toggles, it's a really quick way I might sit down, you know, with Pam or my wife and talk through this so we can have something that really helps us think exactly how we think about our finances and make this really important decision together.

然后它跑完，就给了我这个。我切到这边——这是另一个。这是一个特别直观的办法，让你一眼看懂不同路径对你的存款意味着什么。在这个例子里，我想确保存款永远不低于这 21,000 美元。然后我能看到，我不仅能休这六个月，还能拿出一部分现金投进我的小生意或创业点子——也就是这条橙色的线。它是最低的，但仍然不会跌破三个月的应急储备。在这边，我就会想：要是休七个月呢？八个月、九个月呢？因为有这些调节开关，我可以很快地跟 Pam——或者说我妻子——坐下来一起过一遍，这样我们手里就有个工具，真正帮我们理清自己怎么看待家里的财务，一起做出这个非常重要的决定。

[29:50] Peter

I guess you can build something similar for like retirement planning, you know?

我猜你也可以给退休规划之类的做个类似的东西，对吧？

[29:53] Ethan

Oh, exactly.

哦，没错。

[29:54] Peter

Yeah. Mhm.

对。嗯。

[29:55] Ethan

Again, this goes back again to the beginning when we were talking about personalization. Like whatever decision you're thinking through, you can really build or or quickly get chat to build the sort of model interface, decision tree, you know, just just paring back to you what you're thinking so you can think it through in a deeper way that before this was just way harder to do and way harder to provide this level of service. Right? This is a level of service you might have gotten if you paid for a fee advisor or even an AUM based advisor. And even then,

这又回到我们开头聊的个性化。不管你在琢磨什么决定，你都可以自己搭、或者很快让 ChatGPT 帮你搭出那种模型界面、决策树，就是把你的想法复述给你，让你想得更深。在这之前，这件事要难做得多，要提供这种水准的服务也难得多，对吧？这种水准的服务，以前你可能得花钱请一位收费制的理财顾问、甚至是按 AUM（资产管理规模）收费的顾问才享受得到。而且就算那样，

[30:31] Ethan

you can't just call them every, you know, on a Tuesday on a whim because you're thinking of something and have them crank a model for you. You know, you can now be on the comfort of your couch, have some a hairrained idea maybe, and quickly start to think through Chad GBT.

你也没法随便哪个周二心血来潮、因为想到点什么就给他们打电话，让他们马上给你赶出一个模型。而现在，你可以舒舒服服窝在沙发上，冒出一个也许有点异想天开的点子，就立刻开始用 ChatGPT 把它想清楚。

[30:43] Peter

Dude, you know what's the number one question I ask Ch Finance?

哥们，你知道我问 ChatGPT Finances 最多的问题是什么吗？

[30:46] Ethan

Tell me.

说说看。

[30:47] Peter

I think I think you don't have this problem, but like I always ask it. When can I fat fire? [laughter] Fat fire. And I should have build a dashboard for me. Yeah,

我觉得你应该没这个烦恼，但我老是问它：我什么时候能 fat FIRE？（笑）fat FIRE（富足版 FIRE；FIRE 即提前退休运动：Financial Independence, Retire Early）。我该让它给我做个 dashboard。对，

[30:56] Ethan

that's it. Exactly. And I It's funny. I actually did that um for Jim.

就是这个，没错。说来好笑，我其实给 Jim 做过这个。

[31:01] Ethan

Yeah, for Jim. But because of Jim's situation, it's a little bit underwhelming. Like he can fire full fire at 76 with his current financial situation,

对，给 Jim 做的。但以 Jim 的情况，结果有点让人失望：按他现在的财务状况，他要到 76 岁才能 FIRE，真正完整的 FIRE，

[31:13]

which is a little bit late.

这就有点晚了。

[31:14]

A little bit a little bit late. Yeah,

有点、有点晚。嗯，

[31:16] Ethan

you could lean fire at 66.

66 岁就能 lean FIRE（精简版 FIRE）。

[31:17] Peter

Yeah, but you can't lean fire in the barrier. You have to you have to [laughter]

对，但在湾区可没法 lean FIRE。你得……你得……（笑）

[31:21] Ethan

Well, yeah. Jim lives in Pennsylvania though, right? Again, if we like we're living with the I think Pennsylvania. We're living with the um the the the sort of fantasy here.

嗯，是啊。不过 Jim 住在宾夕法尼亚，对吧？还是那句话，我们这是……我记得是宾夕法尼亚。我们这是在沿用剧里那套虚构设定。

[31:29] Peter

Let me give you some product fee feedback. So,

我给你提点产品反馈吧。是这样，

[31:31] Ethan

please

请讲。

[31:31] Peter

I asked her when can I fat firefire, right? But to properly fatfire, I need to connect my wife's financial accounts too and she doesn't want to do it. [laughter] I have to convince her or like someone to share with the stuff with with her to have her connect her accounts.

我问它我什么时候能 fat FIRE，对吧？但要算准 fat FIRE，我还得把我老婆的金融账户也连上，可她不愿意。（笑）我得说服她，或者找个人把这些东西分享给她，让她把账户连上。

[31:44] Ethan

Yeah. Do you do you know some of the financial details of her accounts, but she just won't connect them?

嗯。那她账户的一些财务细节你知道吗？只是她不肯连？

[31:49] Peter

I mean, yeah. I mean, she has like a lot of Microsoft stock and other stuff, so it'll bring my fatfire age down a lot, you know? So,

嗯，知道啊。她手里有不少 Microsoft 股票之类的，所以能把我的 fat FIRE 年龄拉低一大截，你懂吧？所以，

[31:56] Ethan

so you could just you you honestly could just tell chat.

那你其实完全可以直接告诉 ChatGPT。

[31:59] Peter

Yeah. Oh, I see. Just tell her how how much she has.

嗯……哦，我懂了。直接告诉它她有多少就行。

[32:05] Ethan

Yeah.

对。

[32:05] Peter

Yeah.

嗯。

[32:05] Ethan

And it will add it to your net worth. It'll add it to your assets and then it would reflect right in um it would reflect for you. So you don't actually for some of these you don't need to connect accounts necessarily. You can just tell chat you could upload a statement you know if you had one or you just tell it like this and now it'll track it.

然后它会把这些算进你的净资产、加到你的资产里，然后就会直接反映在……会给你反映出来。所以其实有些东西，你不一定非得连接账户。你可以直接告诉 ChatGPT；手头要是有对账单，也可以上传；或者就像这样直接跟它说，它就会开始追踪。

[32:22] Peter

I I see. I think it's still better to get my wife's accounts somehow. I'll figure out

我明白了。不过我觉得还是想办法把我老婆的账户连上更好。我会想办法

[32:27] Ethan

I totally agree [laughter] the sort of the Yeah. Yeah. I'll let you work on that.

我完全同意（笑），那种……对，对。这事就交给你去搞定吧。

[32:31] Ethan

I can help. Yeah. [laughter]

我可以帮忙。对。（笑）

[32:33] Peter

Got it.

明白。

[32:34]

Cool.

酷。

[32:35] Ethan

All right. Let me let me do one more if you think that'd be useful, Peter. On home buying.

好。Peter，如果你觉得有用，我再演示一个——关于买房的。

[32:40]

Yeah, sure. Yeah. So again, just another example. Again, I used the office for inspiration if people might remember this episode. Um Jim's going to surprise. He's going to buy a house, buy his parents house. And a lot of thing, a lot of times in my own life, I would build a model, take me hours. Should I buy or should I rent? And like I have a degree in finance. This is like this is my area. Like it's too hard. And so with again a sort of prompt here, I'm considering of buying a house. Here's how much. Build me interactive site to help me think through it.

Peter： 好啊，当然。

Ethan： 嗯。那就再举一个例子。还是一样，我从《The Office》里找了灵感，可能有人还记得这一集：Jim 要给个惊喜——他要买房，买下他爸妈的房子。在我自己的生活里，很多时候我都会自己搭个模型，一搭就是好几个小时：该买房还是租房？要知道我可是金融专业出身，这本来就是我的老本行，可还是太难了。所以这次还是一条 prompt：「我在考虑买房，金额是这么多。给我做一个交互式网站，帮我把这件事想清楚。」

[33:15] Peter

Yeah.

嗯。

[33:16] Ethan

And then I get this really great way to see the difference between buying versus renting. And I have these toggles over here that obviously will adjust it to again give me some way to think about this more deeply in a more personalized way than I could have otherwise.

然后我就得到了这么一个特别好用的方式，能看清买房和租房的差别。这边还有这些调节开关，调一下结果就会跟着变，让我能用比以往更个性化的方式，把这件事想得更深。

[33:31] Peter

And you can probably like uh pull information for a specific house that you want to buy, right? Like you just point to some ref and link or

而且你大概还能，呃，调取你想买的某一套具体房子的信息，对吧？比如你直接丢一个 Redfin 链接给它，或者

[33:37] Ethan

totally could. Yeah, this case I just gave it an amount. You could give it the link to the exact house you're considering,

完全可以。对，这个例子里我只给了它一个金额。你也可以把你正在考虑的那套房子的链接给它，

[33:43] Ethan

have it build interactive site for you. If you wanted, you could have it build a spreadsheet that you you could work on as well. You could just keep it in text and help you think through what it means for you financially.

让它给你做个交互式网站。愿意的话，也可以让它做一张电子表格，你自己也能在上面接着改。或者干脆就用纯文字，让它帮你想清楚这在财务上对你意味着什么。

[33:52] Peter

Got it. Super helpful, dude. So, let me ask this. So, we just walked through like five or six different use cases and one of them is a weekly finance update that happens automatically, but like I'm always looking for Chad GP to do more work for me proactively. So, I'm just curious like if you have any other scheduled jobs like maybe you can just talk about them like that that actually help you manage your finances.

明白了，太有用了，哥们。那我问一下：我们刚刚过了大概五六个不同的用例，其中一个是每周自动推送的财务更新。但我一直希望 ChatGPT 能更主动地替我多干点活。所以我挺好奇，你还有没有别的定时任务？可以聊聊那些真正帮你打理财务的。

[34:10] Ethan

So, we right now again when you sign up for finances we just create one of those for you and we do that because there is a limit on how many a plus user and pro user can have. We don't want to take too many of those up by default. But what we'll see users do and what I will do, you know, I'll personally have a handful of these. So, I have the weekly finances update. I have another one that will run monthly, which is checking all my subscriptions. What are all my subscriptions? Have any changed in price recently? Are there any you think I don't need anymore based on what you know about me? And that will just run each month and ping me. I have another monthly that runs that actually sends to me and my wife and we'll show spending this month versus last month and we'll also look at what's happened with our investments and we'll use that as a way to just stay a breast and actually email back and forth is actually pretty great because it'll send an email to both of us and we can engage on that surface which is really awesome. I think those sorry and then I have another one which will sort of be a cash monitor and so what this basically is is like hey again I think I have this run I think monthly but it's basically do I have too much idle cash sitting around in any accounts that isn't earning enough in terms of interest or that I should consider investing because sometimes we just forget

目前呢，你开通 Finances 的时候，我们只会默认帮你建一个这样的定时任务。原因是 Plus 用户和 Pro 用户能建的定时任务数量有上限，我们不想默认就占掉太多名额。不过我们看到用户会这么做，我自己也这么做——我个人就设了好几个。我有那个每周财务更新；还有一个每月跑一次，检查我所有的订阅：我都订了哪些东西？最近有没有哪个涨价了？根据你对我的了解，有没有哪个你觉得我已经用不着了？它每个月跑一次，然后提醒我。还有一个每月跑的，会同时发给我和我太太，对比这个月和上个月的支出，也会看看我们的投资情况，我们就靠它随时掌握家里的财务状况。而且用邮件来回讨论其实挺好的，因为它会给我们俩都发一封邮件，我们就能直接在邮件里交流，这点真的很棒。我觉得那些……抱歉，然后我还有一个，算是现金监控。它基本上就是——我记得这个我也是设成每月跑一次——看看我有没有哪个账户里闲置现金太多、利息赚得不够，或者是不是该考虑拿去投资，因为有时候我们就是会忘了

[35:28] Ethan

yeah that specifically like we had some employer account we forgot to roll it over or we did and it's sitting in cash is one sort of extreme example. But the other one is maybe I have a couple thousand dollars too much in my checking account that I could be earning, you know, three and a half% in my savings account and it'll monitor and tell me that as well.

对，具体来说就像：我们有个以前公司的账户忘了做 rollover（转出），或者转了，但钱一直以现金的形式趴在那儿——这算是比较极端的例子。另一种情况是，我的支票账户里可能多放了几千美元，这些钱本来可以放进储蓄账户，赚大概 3.5% 的利息。它也会盯着这些，提醒我。

[35:46] Peter

And the one with your wife, you just get to send your email or do you get just pin chatbt or something or

那个跟你太太一起的，是它直接给你们发邮件，还是你们就在 ChatGPT 里戳它一下之类的，还是……

[35:52] Ethan

I haven't sent an email to both of us.

我让它给我们俩都发一封邮件。

[35:54] Peter

Okay. I think like technically like all the stuff is read only but technically if you really wanted to like for example if I want to invest in like the index fund every quarter I could technically use browser use to like try to get to invest it right to just keep keep the

好。我理解目前这些功能技术上都是只读的，不过理论上，如果真想的话——比如我想每个季度往指数基金里投一笔——技术上我可以用 browser use（让 AI 直接操作浏览器）去试着完成投资，对吧，好让它一直保持那个……

[36:08] Ethan

I think yeah so I I believe with and we talk you know we are in in partnership and conversation with most of the financial companies in the US most of them will for good reason have at the off step something that blocks agents because they're protecting themselves from people nefariously doing that.

我觉得，嗯，我相信……我们跟美国大多数金融公司都有合作、也一直保持沟通。它们大多数都会在登录验证（auth）那一步设置拦截 agent 的机制，这是有充分理由的，因为它们得防着有人利用这种方式干坏事。

[36:28] Peter

I see. I see.

明白，明白。

[36:28] Ethan

So that step for some will get blocked. There are others we're working with to help whitelist when it's coming from chatbt.

所以在有些机构，这一步就会被拦下来。也有一些机构，我们正在跟它们合作，把来自 ChatGPT 的请求加进白名单。

[36:36] Ethan

So it's off and it's approved and you could do that but it will be hit or miss.

这样它就能通过验证、被放行，你就可以那么操作了，但会时灵时不灵。

[36:40] Peter

Got it. Okay. That that makes sense. Yeah. Because I've uh for better or for worse I I just started like chat GPT is basically my operating system now. Like I don't actually use any websites or apps separately if I can avoid it. So yeah, but I understand financials is more uh sensitive.

懂了。好，这说得通。因为我呢，不管是好是坏，我现在基本上已经把 ChatGPT 当成我的操作系统了。只要能避开，我基本不单独打开任何网站或 App。所以，嗯……不过我理解，金融这块更敏感一些。

[36:55] Ethan

Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

对，没错，没错。

[36:57] Peter

All right. Well, this is super helpful, dude. Cool. So, quickly, let's talk about working on a chatb finances team, right? In some of these other teams, like, you know, in in Codex Chat app, I I see them shipping like multiple times a day and just like doing all kinds of stuff. Are you guys more careful on the chatb finances team or how do you guys work?

好的，这真的太有用了，兄弟。好。那我们快速聊聊在 ChatGPT Finances 团队工作是什么样吧。其他一些团队，比如 Codex、ChatGPT App 那边，我看他们一天发好几次版，各种东西都在做。你们 ChatGPT Finances 团队会更谨慎一些吗？还是说，你们是怎么工作的？

[37:13] Ethan

Well, yeah. So, you know, we're certainly extremely careful when, you know, there's different parts of the stack that can have different ramifications for users, but you know, there's different modes of us being careful across that stack, especially when it comes to dealing with someone's data or the data pipeline or the data store, but we've been fortunate to build our system in a way that, you know, we'll ship all day long. So, just in the last seven days, we've shipped 47 things.

嗯，是这样。我们当然是极其谨慎的——技术栈的不同部分，对用户的影响也不一样，所以在整个技术栈上，我们谨慎的方式也分不同模式，尤其是涉及用户的数据、数据管道或者数据存储的时候。不过我们很幸运，系统的搭建方式让我们可以一整天不停地发布。就说过去七天，我们就上线了 47 项更新。

[37:39] Peter

Wow.

哇。

[37:39] Ethan

For our small team. And so, do the math right. multiple times a day. Some are really small bug fixes, polish, improvements, latency. Some are like smaller features that will show up and obviously some bigger features as you know like will get broken down into smaller features that will be shipping.

对我们这么个小团队来说。你算算，一天好几次。有些是很小的 bug 修复、打磨、改进、延迟优化；有些是会陆续冒出来的小功能；当然，你也知道，大一点的功能会被拆成一个个小功能陆续上线。

[37:53] Peter

Got it.

明白。

[37:54] Ethan

This is true everywhere here. You know we as long as we have you know the right uh testing the right checking the right actual like you know automated testing. The goal is to build as fast as we can in a way that again is integrating the user experience in a way that's secure. all that has to be met and then ship as fast as you can.

我们这儿到处都是这样。只要我们有对的测试、对的检查、真正到位的自动化测试就行。目标就是尽可能快地构建，同时守住用户体验、保证安全。这些条件都满足了，就以最快的速度发布。

[38:15] Peter

Okay. And uh you know I haven't been a PM for a few months now but like and now that I'm solo I just talk to you know AI the whole day but like you know you actually have a team and other people. So how do you bring chat GPT into your meetings and your conversations or like how do you balance talking to the AI versus real humans while doing your job?

好。呃，你知道，我已经有几个月没当 PM 了，现在自己单干，基本上一整天都在跟 AI 聊。但你是真有团队、有同事的。那你是怎么把 ChatGPT 带进你的会议和日常沟通里的？或者说，工作的时候你怎么平衡跟 AI 聊和跟真人聊？

[38:30]

[laughter]

（笑）

[38:30] Ethan

Yeah, it's interesting. What I find is, you know, collaboration with real humans is just as important as it's ever been, but you're actually collaborating kind of higher up the stack in a sense. Instead of, you know, me collaborating with design on this small little thing, we're, you know, on what color this might be. I trust, you know, Rich in our case, he's gonna he's a pro. He's going to figure that out. we're collaborating on like that next feature that's somewhat tricky in terms of the user experience. So we're like higher up the stack or I'm collaborating with an engineer on a new feature but all the way up at the new feature level not like oh this little bit down here or let me write a PRD that's seven pages and we can talk about it that largely doesn't exist unless it's an extremely complex feature. we're just able to collaborate, you know, higher up that I don't know I don't know the exact description, but higher up that stack because we can own so much more ourselves and do so much more ourselves. We're like almost like managers interacting higher up the stack and we both have teams of people.

嗯，这个挺有意思。我的感受是，跟真人协作还是跟以往一样重要，但某种意义上，你们协作的层级更高了。不再是我跟设计师围着一个小细节打转，比如这个东西该用什么颜色——这种事我信任我们的 Rich，他是行家，他会搞定。我们协作的是下一个在用户体验上有点棘手的功能。所以我们是在更上层协作；或者我跟某个工程师一起做新功能，也是站在整个新功能的层面，而不是「哦，下面这一小块怎么弄」，也不是「我先写一份七页的 PRD，然后我们再讨论」——除非是极其复杂的功能，这种做法基本已经不存在了。我们就是能在更上层协作——我也不知道怎么准确描述——就是在整个栈的更上层，因为我们自己能掌控、能做的事多太多了。我们几乎就像两个经理人在更上层互动，而且我们各自手下都有一支团队。

[39:38] Peter

Yeah.

嗯。

[39:38]

And so it's more of like a coarse grain collaboration than that fine grain collaboration that might happen in you know historically on a product team. And and we talked about this on Twitter a little bit, but like what's the artifact that comes out of that collaboration? You know, like the artifact for the agent to actually build, right? Like [laughter] or is just like a is this like a transcript of the meeting or something or like what's the artifact that comes?

Ethan： 所以这更像是一种粗粒度的协作，而不是过去产品团队里常见的那种细粒度协作。

Peter： 这个我们之前在 Twitter 上也聊过一点——那这种协作最后产出的 artifact（产物）是什么？就是交给 agent 去真正动手构建的那个东西，对吧？（笑）还是说，就是一份会议转录稿之类的？到底产出的是什么？

[40:00] Ethan

It really depends. It really depends, you know. So in obviously in meetings we'll have noteaker notetaker will take notes. Notes get pumped into slack. We can revisit them. Our codeexes, our tachibbts can reference slack and reference the notes and so it has that context. It obviously can reference linear. It can reference some of our strategy docs. And so it really depends. But you know when an engineer is starting a feature, it might start with a conversation right of just like what are we thinking about that feature? And really it's probably in our road map somewhere at a pretty high level of granularity, not a super detail level granularity. And then that engineer will likely spin off one or many codeexes talking to it, explaining it to get it going on the actual feature. And then they'll see what it did. And you know the engineers on our team, they have high product taste, high product sense. They kind of know what I'm thinking for the feature and if they don't, they'll ask from that high level and they're able to direct from there codecs to get closer and closer to what it should be. And then they'll have a dog food version and then we'll look at it together.

真的要看情况，看情况。开会的时候，我们当然会有 notetaker（会议记录工具）做笔记，笔记会自动推送到 Slack 里，我们随时可以回看。我们的 Codex、我们的 ChatGPT 都能引用 Slack、引用这些笔记，所以它有这些上下文。它当然也能引用 Linear，还能引用我们的一些战略文档。所以真的要看情况。不过，一个工程师开始做某个功能时，可能先从一次对话开始，就聊聊：我们对这个功能是怎么想的？而这个功能多半已经写在我们路线图的某个地方了，颗粒度比较粗，不是特别细的那种。然后这个工程师大概会开一个或者好几个 Codex，跟它对话、给它讲清楚，让它开始动手做这个功能。然后看看它做出了什么。你知道，我们团队的工程师产品品味很高、产品感很强，他们大概知道我对这个功能是怎么想的；如果不知道，他们会从那个高层面来问我，然后就能从那里指挥 Codex，一步步逼近它应有的样子。之后他们会做出一个 dogfood（内部试用）版本，我们再一起看。

[41:00] Peter

Okay.

好。

[41:00] Ethan

And so long way saying like there's no artifact written in many cases. There's a quick chat and they're off building.

所以绕了一大圈，我想说的是：很多时候根本没有写成文字的产物。就是快速聊几句，他们就开干了。

[41:07] Peter

I guess because the agents can just build the the artifact is just whatever prototype or whatever they come up with, right? But you can play with with it.

我猜是因为 agent 直接就能把东西做出来，所以产物就是他们做出来的原型或者别的什么，对吧？你可以直接上手玩。

[41:13] Ethan

Exactly. Exactly. For us, it's like chat is not chat like talking about the feature and we've we felt like this on product teams forever and like great engineers and designers forever would always say can we stop talking about the work and do the actual work.

没错，没错。对我们来说，这种聊天已经不是那种围着功能空谈的聊天了。我们在产品团队里一直都有这种感受，优秀的工程师和设计师一直都会说：我们能不能别再聊这个活儿了，直接干活？

[41:28] Peter

Yeah.

嗯。

[41:28] Ethan

You know, and so now I think that ratio is shifted even more. You're just doing the work and you know, maybe it used to be like 30% talk about the work, 70% do the work or some other ratio depending on the company. Now it's like 5% talk about the work, 95% do the work. And and to your point, that's exactly how it feels.

所以现在我觉得这个比例变得更悬殊了。你就是一直在干活。以前可能是 30% 的时间聊工作、70% 的时间干活，或者别的什么比例，看公司而定。现在大概是 5% 聊工作、95% 干活。正如你说的，感觉就是这样。

[41:46] Peter

I I think that's a great feeling, right? To actually do the work. [laughter]

我觉得这种感觉很棒，对吧？真真正正地在干活。（笑）

[41:50] Ethan

If you're a maker, if you're a designer, if you're an engineer, if you're, you know, product manager like myself.

只要你是个做东西的人——设计师也好，工程师也好，或者像我这样的产品经理也好。

[41:55] Peter

Yeah.

对。

[41:55]

Who also gets to ship to production by the way. That's why we're here. We want to make the product. But you probably as since the engineers are shipping end to end to a certain extent you probably spend a lot of time with customer conversations or like you know bank conversations and other stuff maybe not shipping a feature right like yes that's my guess yeah we'll do I mean depending on the thing lots of partner conversations depending on the area the product and what we're doing especially if it's assisted or powered by a partner

Ethan： 顺便说一句，我这个产品经理也能自己把东西发布到生产环境。我们来这儿就是为了这个，我们想亲手把产品做出来。

Peter： 不过既然工程师在一定程度上能端到端地交付，你可能会花很多时间跟用户沟通，或者跟银行之类的机构沟通，而不一定是自己去发功能，对吧？嗯，这是我的猜测。

Ethan： 对，我们会……我是说，看具体情况，会有很多跟合作方的沟通，取决于是哪个领域、哪块产品、我们在做什么，尤其是有合作方参与或者由合作方提供支撑的功能

[42:20] Ethan

we'll do a lot of you know actual more traditional UXR to understand how people are using the features what's good what's bad qualitative quantitative that'll all come in and then just we know we're always listening. I mean you see this with the folks open. We're always listening what people are saying out there about the product about the feature you know there's no voice we don't want to hear to incorporate into the product to make the product better.

我们也会做很多更传统的 UXR（用户体验研究），去了解大家是怎么用这些功能的、哪里好、哪里不好，定性的、定量的，这些都会汇总进来。而且我们一直在倾听。你看 OpenAI 的人就是这样，我们一直在听外面大家怎么评价这个产品、这个功能。没有哪种声音是我们不想听的，我们都想把它吸收进产品里，让产品变得更好。

[42:44] Peter

Got it. So what what what's next for chat finances man? Maybe we don't have to share too much but like what is your vision for where this can go like six months or like a year from now you know?

明白。那 ChatGPT Finances 接下来会怎么走，兄弟？也许不用透露太多，但你对它的愿景是什么？比如六个月或者一年后，它能发展到什么样？

[42:52] Ethan

Yeah I mean I can't share anything about what what is coming. I don't have anything to announce today.

嗯，接下来会出什么，我没法透露。今天我没有什么可宣布的。

[42:57] Ethan

Yeah. But high level, you know, the goal for personal finance is to make it so chat GPT can save you time, money, and stress when it comes to your money. And even what we have today is really good at doing that. And so a lot of our focus right now is making the features easier to use, easier to find, easier to discover, and getting the word out about them. And again, improving the product, polishing the product. It's a financial experience. We want it to be perfect. It's really good. good. It's not perfect yet. There's going to be continued work to make it perfect on every dimension. And as we continue to do that, then we'll start thinking about, you know, what other areas of someone's financial life should we be helping with? Should we be making easier to do, faster to do, less effort, save them money, uh, and such? But a lot of our focus right now is, yeah, that product that's out that we're seeing a lot of great traction on, making it even better and getting it more aware that it even exists.

嗯。不过从大方向上讲，个人理财这块的目标，就是让 ChatGPT 在钱的事情上帮你省时间、省钱、省心。其实就算是我们现在已有的功能，在这方面也已经做得很好了。所以我们眼下很多精力都放在让这些功能更好用、更好找、更容易被发现，并且把消息传出去。还有就是继续改进产品、打磨产品。这是跟钱打交道的体验，我们希望它做到完美。它现在已经非常好了，但还不完美，我们会持续努力，让它在每个维度上都做到完美。在这个过程中，我们也会开始思考：一个人的财务生活里，还有哪些领域是我们应该帮上忙的？哪些事我们应该让它变得更容易、更快、更省力、帮人省钱，诸如此类。但我们眼下的重心，还是已经上线的这个产品——我们看到它的势头很好——把它做得更好，并且让更多人知道它的存在。

[43:51] Peter

Yeah, I think that's key, man. I think the onboarding is like super important cuz like you know we just walk through like six really cool use cases but that require like us knowing to submit the prompt and like tell to build a site and all kind of stuff. I think most nor most people just don't get the stuff so you have to like onboard them.

对，我觉得这是关键，兄弟。我觉得新手引导（onboarding）超级重要，因为我们刚刚过了六个很酷的用例，但前提都是我们知道要去输入 prompt、知道让它去搭个网站之类的。我觉得大多数普通人根本想不到这些，所以你得带他们上手。

[44:06] Ethan

Yeah.

对。

[44:06] Ethan

Exactly. And they shouldn't it should be so easy you know you just turn it on easy way to turn it on and then it just works for you.

没错。而且他们本来就不应该需要这样——它应该简单到你只要把它打开，有个简单的方式打开它，然后它就自动为你干活。

[44:12] Peter

Yeah.

对。

[44:13] Peter

That that's that's the dream. And I think there's like a lot of potential with the voice feature too where you can get like, you know, like people have their chief of staff coordinate all the other stuff, but I can imagine like a financial advisor coordinate all my other stuff too.

那就是理想状态。而且我觉得语音功能在这方面也很有潜力——你可以，你知道，就像有人让自己的幕僚长（chief of staff）去统筹其他所有事情一样，我也能想象有个理财顾问帮我统筹其他所有事。

[44:25] Ethan

Totally. Totally. Yeah. And I think Addy has shared publicly, you know, they're working, voice team is working on plugins and finance is one of our plugins and so we're excited about that.

完全同意，完全同意。对，我记得 Addy 已经公开说过，他们在做——语音团队正在做 plugin，而 Finances 就是我们的 plugin 之一，所以我们对这个挺兴奋的。

[44:33] Peter

Awesome, dude. Well, I think between uh finances and health, I think there's so much more that Chad can help with than just like trying to manage your emails and stuff. So really excited about the future.

太棒了，兄弟。我觉得在理财和健康这两块，ChatGPT 能帮上的忙远不止帮你打理邮件之类的。所以我真的很期待未来。

[44:42] Ethan

Me too. Me too.

我也是，我也是。

[44:43] Peter

All right, Ethan. Well, thanks so much for your time, man. And if people want to give you feedback, where can people find you online?

好了，Ethan，非常感谢你抽出时间，兄弟。如果大家想给你反馈，可以在网上哪里找到你？

[44:48] Ethan

You can find me at eblock. Eb oc onx is probably the best place and where I'm most active. Feel free

可以在 X 上找我，账号是 ebloch，E-B-L-O-C-H，那大概是最好的渠道，也是我最活跃的地方。欢迎随时

[44:54] Ethan

to any and anything you have feedback, product ideas. Uh I love hearing from people using the product and want to hear from everyone.

把任何东西发给我，反馈、产品想法都行。呃，我特别喜欢听用户的声音，每个人的意见我都想听。

[45:01] Peter

Cool. And uh thanks for making this your life life's work. I I think you're really going to transform uh millions of people's lives. So, thanks so much.

好的。呃，也谢谢你把这件事当成你毕生的事业。我觉得你真的会改变数以百万计的人的生活。所以，太感谢了。

[45:08] Ethan

Yeah. Thanks so much. Thanks for having me.

嗯，非常感谢，谢谢邀请我。